E66 – Gripped by Addiction: How Tapping Out is the Path to Recovery with Rob Davis

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there were times, many times where, I did not want to use. You know, I'm saying I was done. I was fed up. I had been, I had done enough damage. I had wreaked enough havoc. But there's a point where you're consumed. We call it being caught in the grip, an example that I can use is, I'm a parent, I'm a father. So if I'm going to walk my child across the street, I'm gonna have a grip on their hand or their arm, you know, so I can't, there's, they don't get hit by a car or they don't walk in the street, I'm going to hold on, hold onto them firmly and tightly, and that's the same comes true when it comes to the disease of addiction, you know, we're caught in it.

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Hello everyone. And welcome to at prisoners part in podcast with me, your host Michi J today, we're going to be talking about addictions and how to recover. My guests today. Is going to adequately describe. an addiction as something that has a grip on you. And I want you to think. Of an addiction as a wrestling match. If you seen any before, you know that there's two wrestlers. Think of one. As addiction itself. And the other one as An individual trying to recover. Now let's just say addiction is a gold medalist and has gone undefeated. Many many times. and He is right now holding down many people. How do

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:01:51

we

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beat addiction? How do you recover? If you seen those matches, you've seen the struggling wrestler. Trying to flip the person over or pin them down. Nothing seems to work. This is the same case with addiction. It has a grip on a person and it is tight. And it is. Nearly impossible. to recover. So when you're looking at those wrestlers, What do you see? When a person. Can't get out of the grip. He relaxes and stops. He'd stopped struggling and just taps out. He taps the mat to signal to the ref. That he's done and needs his help to stop the match. Well, this is the same principle you use to get out. Of the grip of addiction and recover. You need to tap out. In today's show my guests will talk about how he was in the grip of addiction and how his recovery came about. I want you to listen and learn. How tapping outlooks. Who is the official referee? And how tapping out. You really win that match. Okay now to talk to us about. Addictions and recovery. Is Mr. Robert Davis. He is a Milwaukee native. He has three children. He's dabbled in real estate. He's now a machine operator and he's also a house manager for a faith based sober living facility. Rob is also a recovering addict. And he has been quite successful in recovering. He's going to share with us how he's done that. Now, please join me in welcoming Rob.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:03:48

Hi, Rob.

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Hello. How you doing?

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:03:51

Hey, all right. I'm doing good. It's great to have you here, Rob. And I'm just here to listen to you and have you tell us your story. Could you tell us a little bit more about yourself? Tell us about Rob.

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Well, thank you so much for giving me an opportunity. my name is Rob Davis. I'm 46. I was born and raised in Milwaukee. I went to a Lutheran grade school, Lutheran high school. I had a passion for golf. I pursued a career in the golf business, uh, I went to college to become a head golf professional, and I worked at Black Wolf Run and Whistling Straights up in Cola, Wisconsin. unfortunately, I was involved in a car accident, as a result of, the beginning, of an early addiction to drugs and alcohol. I came home, from college and I started selling cars and, three and a half years in, I never, never completed. My degree was a bachelor's in business and marketing with an emphasis in the golf industry. I became very successful at an early age, making, uh, making good money, um, developed a passion for real estate. And after 15, almost 16 years in the car business, I was able to, acquire three properties, two in Wisconsin and one in Georgia.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:05:15

Wow. I didn't even know all this. And you come from a two parent home

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:05:21

Yeah. Yeah. I come from a two parent home. I'm I was the youngest out of three. My parents were a little older, um, unfortunately, both of them have passed, but ironically, my mom and dad had the same birthday, same month, same day, different years. My dad was born in 36 and my mom was born in 44, March 29th.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:05:42

Wow. Rob, you said you developed an addiction. How did you actually get introduced to this? Do you know what led to this addiction?

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:05:54

that's, uh, that's a really good question. Growing up, I was, I was pretty much a square, you know, I didn't really drink or party in high school. Um, but once I got to college, you know, I started to experiment a little bit and, I kind of found the party scene and, I really had a personality where, I like to please people, you know, I like to make people laugh and, you know, um, Looking back now, I kind of was just wearing a mask all the time, you know, trying to impress other people and try and, entertain them or make them laugh or make them think I was cool or tough and, and I was essentially just trying to fit in.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:06:32

so do you know why you felt the need to please other people? I'm just wondering, have you ever, sat down and thought about that.

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:06:42

Well, today, I work a recovery program through Narcotics Anonymous. I go to meetings, I have a sponsor. I worked at 12 steps and, part of that program and process is, as you work through the steps, you're, you're really kind of peeling off layers of the onion to uncover, um, some of those things that you're asking about, you know, like the, the why, you know, and as I continue to work through the program, I, I'm learning more and more about myself. You know, the, the more work that I do and the more work that I put in.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:07:18

So that's a work in progress. So, yes.

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Uh, it is, it really is. I mean, I came from a good upbringing. I came from a good family. I didn't, you know, um, it wasn't my environment that, that led me to, to drugs and alcohol. I like, I like to have fun. You know, I never wanted to admit that I was an addict. In my mind, um, an addict was a junkie who was shooting up heroin, you know, I mean, I continued to tell myself, I just like to have a little fun. I just like to party, you know. and as I've, learned through the program, that, it's kind of hard to, it's kind of hard to describe.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:07:58

you don't have to have the exact right words and that's the beauty of it. We can just, express ourselves we can just. accept it's no judgment here because we all are recovering from something and if we're honest with ourselves, we have the same symptoms. And that's what I like to talk about here is bringing us to light and learning how to Heal from it and just forgiveness, forgiving ourselves, allowing ourselves to forgive other people because we're all the same. We all have issues. We all have things we need to just plainly recover from.

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yeah, no, I, I completely agree with you. You know, so today, you know, I'm not ashamed of the fact that, that I went through, uh, the things that I went through and that, you know, I developed an addiction and, um, now today I can admit to the fact that, that, once I started using, I couldn't stop. You know, so, today when, whenever I introduce myself, that's how I introduce myself. I'm, my name's Rob and I'm a recovering addict. Well,

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:09:14

Yeah. Some people may think, well, you're not. Just a recovering addict, but why in your estimation, do you need to say that? Because I think it's a wealth of information there. So why do you need to say that?

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um, one of the things that I've learned, through the program is that, there's three key spiritual principles, and today I try and apply those to my life on a daily basis. the first one is honesty. Um, the second one is open mindedness, and the third one is willingness. And there's a number of other spiritual principles that, come, come through the program as well. You know, being patient, and, using tolerance, and, acceptance, humility is a big piece. But, first of all, I've got to be honest with myself, um, and today my honesty is that this is who I am. This is, this is going to be a lifelong process and, you know, I'm not, I'm not ashamed to admit that I'm a recovering addict today, you know, and by doing that, maybe I can, Encourage, or support, or give someone else hope that may be struggling or dealing with a situation, um, and, you know, maybe give them some encouragement along the way.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:10:43

I like that. Because what I find everything that we are recovering from, everyone is recovering from something or a mistake that as often as we forget. Or don't just acknowledge how much we need help, how weak we are,

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Mm hmm.

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that's pretty in my own experience. I find that very dangerous. So, and that's that lack of humility. Am I on track here with that with you

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Yeah. Oh, absolutely. You know, and, the, the fellowship also, um, Focuses on having a higher power, you know, I have a higher power, whom I choose to call God, and it's only through his unbelievable grace and mercy, that I'm able to be where I am today. I was in and out of jail, you know, over a dozen times, sent to prison. my addiction took me away from all the things that I had cared about, you know, my family, my children, a successful career, you know, just relationships in general, you know, I, I got to a point where I had lost, The feeling to, to really love or care about anyone or anything, and it got to a point of just, I was living to use and using to live, you know, and, um, God saw fit to sit me down and, I did two years in prison. I got out, July 18th, 2023. And my biggest prayer daily was to be able to see my daughter graduate high school. and, uh, God had answered that prayer along with many others. And I was granted, uh, ERP, which is an early release program. Um, I should have done more time. Um, But, uh, I got out eight months early after, uh, completing, uh, two years and three different facilities. Um, and I was home and I was able to see my daughter, graduate high school. And, yeah, it was, it was a huge blessing, you know?

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:13:00

So what would you say? I forget the president's wife. Was it Bush was Nancy Bush. Forgive me if I got her name wrong. And it was the beginning of the war on drugs. And she had

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Oh, Nancy Reagan.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:13:16

Reagan isn't Nancy

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Nancy Reget,

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:13:19

Okay. What was what? What did what did she say? You know where I'm going, right?

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Her program was the D. A. R. E. program.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:13:25

And what did

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D. A. R. E. to keep kids off her pro I believe her, um, Her program was the D. A. R. E. program. D. A. R. E. Daring to keep kids off drugs.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:13:34

Okay. And what was her mom? Just what? It was just so she made

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Oh, just say no. Just say no.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:13:43

Okay. Thank you for cleaning that up for me. Just

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Yes, ma'am.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:13:49

no. So what And you said you used it and you couldn't stop and she's saying, just say no. What do you say to

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:14:01

Well, I say easier said than done. You know, um, the, the literature, uh, through the fellowship talks about, we call addiction a disease, the disease of addiction. And, our fellowship says that It's a mental, physical, and spiritual disease that we suffer from. And the core of our disease, which is the spiritual part, is our total self-centeredness. So we get, we get to a a point where it's just like a number of other diseases. They're obsessive and they're compulsive. So, I mean, you, there were times, many times where, I did not want to use. You know, I'm saying I was done. I was fed up. I had been, I had done enough damage. I had wreaked enough havoc. But there's a point where you're consumed. We call it being caught in the grip, you know, and, an example that I can use is, I'm a parent, you know, I'm a father. So if I'm going to walk my child across the street, I'm gonna have a grip on their hand or their arm, you know, so I can't, there's, they don't get hit by a car or they don't walk in the street, you know, I'm going to hold on, hold onto them firmly and tightly, you know, and that's kind of, um, the same comes true when it comes to the disease of addiction, you know, we're caught in it. It's got a firm hold on us. And, I mean, you can have a sincere desire to want to stop using, But, uh, sheer willpower, you know, will only last for so long.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:15:36

Mm hmm. Yeah. And we call that, um, a worldview, um, cause they're not taking in the spiritual concept. And yeah, I feel the same way about that. Just say no. And you brought that really clear and what you're saying is a spiritual core to it. So, and you talked about humility and

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Yes, ma'am.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:16:01

so you can have that humility, which you show all the time by, when you introduce yourself and just reminding yourself to that you are vulnerable. And you can't just say no, it's more to it than that.

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No, no, there's so much more to it. I mean, as long as there's been, uh, people on the earth, you know, addiction has been around, you know, and, and addiction can come in many different forms, whether it's TV, whether it's food, porn, sex, gambling, drugs, sugar, alcohol, like work. Some people are addicted to work, you know, money. I mean, there can be so many different, um, um, so many different areas in which the disease of addiction can display itself, you know? So, um, I think that's a really, really good point.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:17:05

I'm glad you brought all that up because everyone learn from this because everyone is going through this in some type of a way. I mean, we can actually see it when every year when people do a new year's resolution, right?

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Sure. Absolutely. I want to eat less. I want to watch less TV. I want to get off, uh, the tablet. I want to, whatever it is. Sure. Absolutely.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:17:31

Yeah, that's a good point. A lot of people are addicted to their phones.

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Without a doubt. Facebook, Instagram, you know, um, all those other platforms, you know, they can consume us, you know, where we spend more time on these things than we do, in a relationship with God, in a relationship with our family or kids, um, or, or anything else. And so it can just be a really, really big distraction.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:17:58

All right. And what we, one good way to tell what it is you're addicted to is, I just heard that this week in one of my Bible classes, Connor said, hi, Connor, if you're listening, that you're The first thing you do in the morning, what do you, what are you impulsive to do? What are you reaching for? And that generally tells you what you're addicted to. We, we also, we also see it on what you spend your money on. We look at your, your bank account. Where's most of your money going to? And that can tell you as well, reveal what you're addicted to.

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:18:40

Yeah, no, I completely agree with you. I remember, hearing a message from Dr. Charles Stanley, about the same, the very same thing, you know, opening your checkbook and seeing, you know, what you're spending your money on, you know, where are you spending your time, what are the things that, um, Uh, that you're participating in the most, you know, a lot of times people wake up. The first thing they do is have a coffee or have a cigarette or, you know, look at the phone. And, I can remember, also hearing a message from Adrian Rogers, that really, uh, caught my ear. He said, uh, before he goes to sleep at night, when he takes his shoes off, he puts them on. Laying underneath the bed so that when he gets up in the morning. He has no Option except to get on his knees as soon as he gets up. Yeah

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:19:37

And what he's doing is he's putting in place things to keep him in step where normally we would do things. And to put things in place to keep us out of step and. And we, or we're too close. To borders and we don't have any.

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Right.

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what, what are some of the borders you use? What are some of the steps you take to keep you grounded? I know for sure when you are saying every time you introduce yourself what else it's like. I'm a recovering addict. I believe that's one of the things you do.

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Sure. Well, I really I've really been working on prayer meditation

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:20:33

Mm

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the way that I pray Not just praying for myself or praying for things or to accomplish things or receive things But I've really learned how to pray Uh, more and more consistently for other people. Um, Not for myself.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:20:50

I'm gonna break that down a little bit because I'm sorry to interrupt you because so many people think that When they hear that some people are going to automatically get turned off and say, oh, this is just religious. I'm not religious, but everybody is religious in some way or form. It's just what you do continuously. You're that's that's your religion. So, to clear that up, why, why do you pray and meditate? What is it doing right then and there?

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Well, um, for me, and I can only speak for myself. Um, I know where I was, you know, and I know that, surrender is another key that we focus on, at the fellowship, you know, not having to fight anymore. And today I consistently pray for God's will to be done in my life instead of me trying to take control over what's going to happen or of certain situations. But, um, The way that I was thinking, the way that I was acting and living, got me to where I was. Jails, institutions, and, spiritual death, you know? And the only one who, was able to bring me through that, was God. You know, so, he never left me. I left him by walking away. I was raised, you know, in church. I went to a Lutheran grade school, K through 12. I went to a Lutheran high school in Wauwatosa. I went to Wisconsin Lutheran, graduated in 96. So I always had faith, you know, I went to college. I kind of distanced myself from that. Um, You know, really got stuck in, in the worldview of, you know, doing what I wanted to do, have fun, you know, enjoy yourself, you know. Um, and then I got,

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:22:47

I like,

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well, yeah,

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:22:48

I was going to go back, sorry about that, that we, where did you get your faith from? Like, did you grow up in some sort of, um, Christian or, you know, spiritual atmosphere to get you to go back to that? So, and you made a good point. The first you talked about. you're recovering at it. You always introduce yourself that way. It's bringing forth honesty, open mindedness, willingness and humility right there. First, you're, you're out of your, your self independence, which is contrary, which is opposite of what the world and what, uh, dare would say, just say no, because now you're

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:23:37

right.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:23:38

that you're not, you have to Not just look at things about yourself because you couldn't buy yourself. she was saying, just say no. So you couldn't do it by yourself. So this

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:23:52

No, not at all.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:23:53

spiritual, which led you to the spiritual side, right? Um, something out outside of yourself. So you had to pray and meditate and you're saying you had to spend time with God because you're praying to who? Who are you praying to?

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:24:13

I was praying that, to my higher power, who I choose to call God, you know, I believe that, Jesus died and, and, rose on the third day, and, he's forgiven me for my sins. The Bible says that our sins are as far as the east is from the west. So, um, I'm very grateful that, uh, that today I can, uh, look back. And, forgive myself, you know, for the harm that I caused, uh, my family, my friends, my employers, myself, you know, um, and so today I choose to, to give back, I, uh, I do service work. I volunteer through narcotics anonymous, um, and a program we call H and I, which is hospitals and institutions where we take the, and a message into, treatment centers, hospitals, recovery centers. Um, and we're currently working on getting back into the DOC to introduce the NA message,, to let other addicts know that, That we can stop using drugs, we can lose the desire to use, and we can find a new way to live, you know, so we try and, uh, go into these facilities and share our experience, our strength, and our hope,

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:25:37

So the name of this program is what again?

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:25:40

Narcotics Anonymous is the fellowship that I belong to, and then we have a division Or a branch called H and I, uh, and those that's abbreviated hospitals and institutions. So we go into,

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:25:55

Is it faith based?

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:25:56

uh, it's not, it's the, the program is, the spiritual program, not religious. So, um, it, uh, it's not a Christian program. It isn't a faith based program. It's a spiritual program. That, um, is founded on spiritual principles. So,

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:26:16

hmm. And you choose, it's just, it gives a person to choose who they look to as the spiritual power. I mean, higher power, is that it? That's the difference?

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:26:28

yeah, the, the program, um, suggests that, um, we get a higher power and we can choose, you know, the higher power is up to us to choose, you know, the only requirements are that it's loving and caring and greater than ourselves. So, um, it isn't inclusive. It isn't exclusive, you know, um, but for me, I choose to call my higher power God, you know, uh, and a number of people do.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:26:57

yeah. So with that in mind, did you go to any programs outside of this one that did not include the spiritual core?

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:27:06

Um, I went to a treatment center in, um, Prescott, Arizona. Um, it was a sober living facility, but it was not a faith based.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:27:22

Do you find it a big difference?

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:27:25

Um, for me personally, I do. Because, um, I know that I was created. I know that I have a creator, you know, and I know that I have a purpose. So today I'm trying to fulfill my purpose. I've been able to look to others, follow some directions, take some suggestions, and by the grace of God, I've been able to find a new way to live. So yesterday I actually celebrated 33 months clean and sober.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:27:59

Oh, wow. Congratulations.

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:28:02

Yeah. Thank you.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:28:04

That's, that's a good accomplishment and great accomplishment.

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:28:08

Yeah, like I said, I'm 46 and, I've been in and out of treatments, a few times. Um, I was at a treatment center in Milwaukee on Capitol Drive, I was there 89 days, my mom passed away. Um, I didn't know how to deal with that, you know, I didn't know how to handle those feelings and emotions, because she passed away all of a sudden over a weekend. Uh, and I relapsed, you know, and I went back out to the streets, for a year and a half, two years, you know, got arrested a number of times. Um, I went to a sober living in, in Waukesha,, I was there 11 months, that was the longest amount of sobriety I'd ever had, you know, uh, as an adult, I was 30 something, And I relapsed, lost my apartment, lost my car, lost everything. And, um, you know, it took another couple of years of being homeless, living on the streets, working the door at different spots, you know, just doing whatever I could do to, to get one more, you know, um, And God finally saw fit to, sit me down for a couple of years. Um, finally got a prison sentence, you know, the judge really read me the riot act and told me that I had wreaked havoc all over Southeastern Wisconsin. You know, um, I had been boosting for a number of years and, you know, stolen substantially from all over the state on probation in four counties. So, you know, I was, um, I mean, I was out of my mind. I was out of control, you know, and nothing could stop me except, um, God put me in a prison cell.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:29:48

Audience. I want you to know that. It's so easy for us to just put things aside and say, oh, this is just this person's issue or problem and that's not me and things like that. But we are doing the same things in our own addictions. We relapse all the time. We need to look at it that way. So that's why I'm, saying this and to, get Rob to give us some more detail on how he was able to overcome his addiction, because this is one of the stronger ones. So if he can overcome this addiction and what he's been going through, that's going to help. Everyone, so he did say admitting it, being humble about it and just being honest and open minded like he's doing here understanding is a spiritual concept because it's not like Nancy Reagan just say no. it's a grip. So is he wants to say no, we want to say no, everybody else can, we can attest to that. But he had to spend time with God because you say he set you down, which is incarceration. And a lot of people, we'll say that it's not a good thing to incarcerate people. And it's not, it can be good or bad. It just depends. But I think it gave you a time to. sit back and pray and meditate. Whereas you probably wouldn't have that time to do that. And you were forced to do it at this point where you were. Able to listen to God, God does that as a heavenly father. He will sit you down and to get a chance to pour into you,

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:31:40

you know, I completely agree, you know, um. Because if I wasn't, uh, I mean, I wasn't at a point where I could stop on my own, you know, um, if I, I honestly believe that, um, if I didn't go to prison, if I really didn't get that, uh, that level of punishment, it would, it would have just been a matter of time, you know, before I, uh, continued doing what I had been doing. So,

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:32:08

makes sense. Which makes sense. That's, that's going to be the natural order of things as people would say that science and that is true. So again, you. You were being humble now, you're actually being transparent, even now, open minded, understanding that you couldn't do it on your own. And that's really not what the world would say, and not what our actions would say our behavior. We, we actually try to live out, just say, no, meaning that I'm just going to do it by myself. I'm going to do it. Go by myself. I can do it when I want to and I can do it this way in there and it's no where anybody can do it themselves. So, I like how you are going into detail about that and how you had to have a higher power. Someone outside of yourself to help. You pray and meditate and what are some of the things you meditated on?

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:33:17

well, um, the first thing is, just. Being able to surrender, for a long time. Um, I was a fighter, you know, I had the mentality of, you know, not giving up, not taking no for an answer, you know, never that's a sign of weakness. You know, you're soft if you give up. and I think that's kind of, um, How a lot of men view things today too. I mean, even, for example, when I was married, you know, uh, asking for directions, you know, taking guidance, it's like, I'm going to tell my wife at the time. I know where we're going, you know, and I'm driving in a circle for 20 minutes, you know, cause I don't, I don't feel manly. I don't feel like a man if I have to ask for help, and today I realized that it takes more courage to ask for help to let someone know that, you know, you do have vulnerabilities, you know, and surrender means I don't have to fight anymore. that was a huge hurdle for me to overcome. Um, because I never wanted to give up. I never wanted to be soft. And I wanted to portray an image of, of being tough and, macho, you know, I mean, for a long time, I had a big, big ego, and there are still times today where, you know, I deal with that as a, as a character defect, or a shortcoming, um, but, praying, and meditating, and asking God to remove some of these things, you know, Being conceited, being arrogant, you know, thinking I know it all, you know, not wanting to ask for help, thinking that I'm smarter or better looking or more successful, you know, pride is another one, and I think that's why God took some of the gifts and the blessings away from me that he had given me. I had, um, I had owned three properties by the time I was 28, had made six figures six times, you know, and from the world standpoint, I was very successful, you know, at an inground swimming pool, nine feet deep with a diving board, had a four car garage. You know, I had a beautiful home in Pewaukee, um, had a vacation home in Georgia, six acres on a mountain,

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:35:43

Mm

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:35:43

um, paid a 1, 700 mortgage for seven years. And we would go there for 10 days a year over Easter, you know, with my ex wife and our kids and my nieces. and I really had put God off to the side and not given him thanks, for, the gifts that he had given me and, and he had, uh, blessed me with. And, and, and trusted me with, and I was taking credit for a lot of these things on my, on my own, like I did this, I have this, I have these properties, I make this much, I, I, I, me, me, me, my, my, my. And slowly, yeah, and then slowly he, he, he took them away, you know, one at a time,

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:36:25

I like that you, said, success can be just as much of a trap as being poor. Yeah. Both of those skills.

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:36:35

without a doubt. Yeah, I mean, I can have a big bank account and a nice 401k, um, and be spiritually broken and be spiritually bankrupt, you know, and what does all that give me? You know, nothing, you know, cause sooner or later, I can't take it with me. And you realize that, you know, life is more than, uh, finances and 401ks, you know, today, um, I'm happier than I was making, you know, a half that money, you know, because, um, I, I look at relationships as more valuable. Then income today, you know, relationships with my children, um, relationships with, some of the men here at the house, you know, being able to encourage and support and give back and, uh, help other recovering addicts. You know, to me, that's success. If I can, if I can help someone else to, find a new way to live. And to change old behaviors and, and, and put down the drugs and alcohol. And, you know, to me, that's more rewarding than. You know, selling X amount of cars or making 10, 000 in a month, you know, because at the end of the day, you know, that there's no, there's no joy in that, you know, and you're back on that hamster wheel of chasing and chasing and, and my, for me, um, it, it, it, it distracted me from what my real focus was, what my real purpose is, you know, that's to give back and to, and to help others.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:38:25

I like that you pointed out relationships because we need those relationships back you said you had a hard time forgiving yourself.

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:38:35

Yeah, I did. I, um, I was at I was in treatment when my mom passed away. Um, I was 89 days clean and sober. And at that time, that was the longest amount of sobriety I'd ever had. And she passed. I went to her funeral. but as the next few years went on, My addiction grew, you know, and I was, I was caught deeper and deeper in this, dilemma. And, my father passed away while I was incarcerated and I wasn't able to attend his funeral because, I was in prison.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:39:09

When you said, forgiving yourself because I have, you know, I hear that a lot and it makes sense. So were you angry at yourself?

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:39:23

Yeah. I was angry at myself. I was, uh, disappointed at myself, um, for not just, you know, letting me down, but letting my parents down, uh, letting my family down, letting my children down, being absent, you know, missing, uh, school events and, uh, a number of things that I had participated in, you know, uh, in the years prior. So, it's, it's like a friend of mine told me once, um, it's easier to, it's easier to look out the window than it is to look in the mirror, you know, um, and you know, it's so true, you know, but regarding the forgiveness piece, you know, I have to realize that I am forgiven, you know, and in order for, uh, I've got to accept that, you know, God has forgiven me for what I've done. And I'm not honoring him. If I'm not forgiving myself, you know, it's kind of, in my eyes, it's, it's somewhat disrespectful to God that he laid down his life to forgive me for my sins, for my wrongdoings, for my mess. But it would be, selfish and self centered of me to not forgive myself, to put myself in a greater regard than, Then he is, you know, cause he's already told me it's over. It's done. It's you're forgiven. So, but for a long time now that was hard to do because I, I mean, I couldn't, I couldn't apologize to my mom anymore. I couldn't apologize to my dad. He couldn't see me clean and sober, you know, before he passed. So, um, so yeah, that was difficult. That was a challenge.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:41:18

this is very good. I like everything you've brought up now because relationships are the most important like you said and a lot of times we our relationships are broken and our the main relationship is with God, I would believe

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:41:35

right.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:41:36

and when we break off relationships, we lose that intimacy. We tend to run away from we tend to hide and. Run away from God instead of running to him.

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:41:52

Yeah, I, uh, I mean, I, I ran away from him for years, you know, I mean, and it's, it doesn't make sense when you look back at it because here he is. You know, blessed me with a number of gifts, you know, um, family, children, uh, at that time properties, uh, successful career, you know, and I wasn't, I wasn't, um, showing my gratitude, you know, I wasn't taking care of the things that he entrusted me with. You know, at the time when I should have been, uh, closest to him, you know, showing my appreciation and thanking him for the many, many blessings that he had given me, you know, um, I was consumed with me and myself and, and taking credit for, uh, the things that I, that I had been given. I got them for myself when in all reality I had done nothing, you know, he had provided them for me

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:42:56

Yeah, we do live in that delusion, at times, and it's a lot of people still stuck there, I even go in and out myself, I keep reminding myself, and I like how you started off, like, I am a recovering addict. Maybe we all should say that. And so we can keep reminding ourselves that it's not us. And. Everything, everything is related to the higher power in him, allowing us to be able to do the functions that we do, even the simplest of things. And that keeps us in that keeps me and I'm hearing it in your conversation as well, that this relationship with, the higher power with God. Because. In our estimation, what we're seeing, he's the only way and that's what your recovery has, done from you is get you right back to the nitty gritty and what's really important and actually it's a, I call that really a, a good thing that happened to you, so to speak, because. It actually brought you into a right relationship and understanding just how, just how weak you are. Just how weak I am. I've noticed myself. and that's, when you're really alive and really.

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:44:20

Amen. Yeah, um, one of the things That I've said for for the last three years now is that God brought me And N. A. has brought me back to God. So, um, I'm, I'm very grateful for, for the opportunity, for my freedom, for my clean time, for the fellowship. You know, for HTR, you know, um, I had lost all three of my homes, in my addiction. And, um, when I was coming to the end of my sentence, I, I didn't have anywhere to go, you know, and, um, I had gotten in touch with, my old financial advisor and, He was perplexed to say the least to find out where I was and I had mentioned to him that I was wanting to pursue a faith based sober living when I got released and He put me in touch With, LT Austin and Bob Wolf, who, had just recently, the year before started HTR hope to restoration. It was a blessing that,, God put that on my heart to call. Dan Detloff, and, I got in touch with, LT and Bob, and, they came and picked me up at Black River Falls, three hours away, and, brought me to, HTR, and I've been here ever since.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:45:46

Wow, this is a great comeback story and it's amazing what God can do and take us at our lowest points. So people in our audience, please know it's, it's never too late. You just turn to him and and he was sending you the right people and the people will come get you

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:46:11

Amen.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:46:13

So and you I believe because of your experience it helps you be relatable to everyone because everyone have some sort of addiction and Just hearing your story and how you got out. I like how you mentioned that you're much happier than when you were, you had the money because we see people all the time to have a lot of money. They're never satisfied. they always want more. Even though they have ton of stuff, but they're never satisfied.

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:46:48

yeah, yeah, addiction, doesn't discriminate, age, race, gender, sex, sexuality, creed, you know, it doesn't matter, I mean, anyone, uh, anyone can, uh, can fall into that grip, you know, at any time. And like we talked on in a number of areas, so today three things I really try and do or stay away from, you know, certain people, certain places and certain things, you know, um, I try and stay connected with, the fellowship, you know, I try and give back. I try and do service work, here at the house. We have a Bible study, you know, we're connected with, with so many different, positive opportunities and relationships success is, all about your determination, you know, how bad you want something and if you're willing to put the work in to get it, and one of the things that I've, I've, I've constantly prayed for too, is that God does not allow me to forget the pain and the wreckage that I caused because I never want to go back, to that way of life. I constantly want to remember, the things that I went through, the things that I put other people through, I want to remember the pain, you know, so it acts as fuel for me to keep, my recovery first.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:48:07

I thank you so much, Rob, for being here and talking about recovery and how you actually are successful at it and just giving us the knowledge that you don't have to come from a poor background, you can come from a very successful background and end up in this type of predicament because. Anybody could be there. So is there anything else you want to say to the audience before we wrap this up today.

GMT20240917-160018_Recording_separate2: 00:48:39

I just want to say thank you, MeTJ. I appreciate, the opportunity, to share my story and, just keep God first, you know, if you're struggling with a substance, alcohol or drugs, you don't have to use again, there's programs out there, there's people out there that, will help and support you, and, will help you with your recovery.

Track 1 - Michi J: 00:49:01

,thank you so much. Thank you everyone for listening and may you have a week filled with blessings..